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mahsanm · #**181** 11-22-2009, 07:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Saba.

Err have you ever watched his show?

Aur idhar yeh baat hi naheen ho rahi ke Qadiani Muslim hain ya non-Muslim.

Exactly! yeh baat ja ker Aamir Liaqat ko batao. ultay seedhay fatweh wohi de raha hai.

no i dont watch his show. na he wo koi mullah hai, naam ki darhi rakh lenay say, n scholars/ullema say baatain kar lenay say koi mullah nahi ban jata

mahsanm · #**182** 11-22-2009, 07:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lahoriii

seriously? he said that... yaar yeh kya hai emaan say lol...shakal kuch dikhatay hai, hothay kuch aur hai...iman say i did not expect this from him

ye 2005 ki pic hai, tab tak wo shayad aalim online main mashhoor nahi hua tha,

Emaan Q · #**183** 11-23-2009, 04:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by komal*

Come on yaar, what is this? 'sharam' = shame, and you seriously think its only the women who are associated with the concept of shame but not men? What kind of shame in what context are you reffering here? It would've made sense had you said the concept shame is more vigoroulsy used for women when it comes to the idea of modesty and chastity, but saying the men are completely immune to this concept and its various and versatile meanings is just an extreme display of covering up for sake of it. To me the term and its message becomes ridiculously obvious when it comes to women, for example a woman in our part of the world seen without a dupatta will invoke all sorts of bitching in the name of sharam o hiya but men can literally commit adultery evey night yet get away with it because a naked eye can only notice so much of corruption of 'sharam o hiya' in men. Now don't tell me men messing around with women or selling its self is still considered all ghairatmand, basharem, naik creature. There's a clear dirty gender bias in our society.

Well fair enough...men aren't totally excluded when referring to the "besharam" aspect and yes maybe I went to an extreme while describing this term pertaining to women's dressing. Maybe I should have made clear that a woman's dressing revolves around sharam and well it can't be directly said about the men. Maybe I had a wrong understanding of this world due to it being used quite a lot for women. I think it was my mistake to burn out all the chances for this term to be used for men and conjure up a version of sharam revolving around females only. Perhaps I got hooked up too much on this statement while conjuring an explanation here..."Larkiyon ki tarah kion sharma rahay ho" LOL. Anyhow, yes you could have been misleaded by my post since it did have an extreme touch to it. The word is indeed mostly used for women which is what I should have said initially. Fair enough.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Electric

Orrite, but i guess in your previous post you werent basically undermining the lingual differences were you?Or even if you were then how does a basic translation of those words just limitize it to just one specific gender? I know you are not denying it but the point is that how can sharam or haya be just limited to one gender because of a translation difference.
I dont get your point as to how it can be just used for females ?

Yes, I was only extrapolating on my understanding of the terminology. As I explained earlier, because of the universal usage of this word mostly pertaining to the female society, I strayed away while making an assumption. While I should have said that it is "mostly" used for women. But then again, we wouldn't know until this term is used equally as much for both the genders. Anyhow yes it is mostly used for women in terms of clothing or whatnot but the possibility of it being used for men can't be completely ruled out.

Electric · #**184** 11-23-2009, 04:28 AM

^
Fair enough

Das Boot · #**185** 11-23-2009, 04:32 AM

I support jzb!

Emaan Q · #**186** 11-23-2009, 04:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Das Boot

I support jzb!

LOL thank you.

Saba. · #**187** 11-23-2009, 06:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mahsanm

no i dont watch his show. na he wo koi mullah hai, naam ki darhi rakh lenay say, n scholars/ullema say baatain kar lenay say koi mullah nahi ban jata

usne Islamic Studies parha huwa hai Trinity College se jo exist bhi naheen kerta. Mujhe pata hai ke woh aik proper scholar/aalim/mullah naheen hai lekin yeh baat usko ja ker samjhao. Agar aalim samajh rahi hoti main tho uski tareef ker rahi hoti!

Saba. · #**188** 11-23-2009, 06:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lahoriii

seriously? he said that... yaar yeh kya hai emaan say lol...shakal kuch dikhatay hai, hothay kuch aur hai...iman say i did not expect this from him

Yeah i'm not even Ahmedi/Qadiani and even i was like WTF! it's on youtube.

And here are his "degrees"

mahsanm · #**189** 11-23-2009, 05:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Saba.

usne Islamic Studies parha huwa hai Trinity College se jo exist bhi naheen kerta. Mujhe pata hai ke woh aik proper scholar/aalim/mullah naheen hai lekin yeh baat usko ja ker samjhao. Agar aalim samajh rahi hoti main tho uski tareef ker rahi hoti!

wo akela tu hai nahi yahan, kitnay he log self-proclaimed scholars banay huay hain, koi kisi ko kia samjha sakta hai, best solution yahi hai k avoid them n un k program na dekho

Saba. · #**190** 11-23-2009, 10:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mahsanm

wo akela tu hai nahi yahan, kitnay he log self-proclaimed scholars banay huay hain, koi kisi ko kia samjha sakta hai, best solution yahi hai k avoid them n un k program na dekho

I know i never claimed he's the "only" one.

And yeah i don't watch Geo.

Resonant · #**191** 11-24-2009, 09:44 AM

Well there is a genuine reason for Muslim women for Purdah, and that is, that their religion ask them to do....that's all.
Why Islam asked women for Pardah?.....Because:

1-In the cultured societies at that time and before, the Purdah was associated with Modesty...The highly respectful ladies used to do Hijab, while the concubines (kaneez and londis) were not following this practice. So it was a cultural thing. . .A cultural thing which was not peculiar to arab societies only....That is the reason that during Haj and Umrah when men and women are reminded there true status of 'Slaves of Allah', they are advised to be in a state which resembles the external state of slaves,...men cant cover there heads (Covering of head was also a sign of a respectful person in society), women cant cover there Faces.....etc.

2- It gives some relief and protection to woman....If she is ugly or beatiful, in both cases it is a protection for her.

3-It gives a higher status to the muslim woman, because she understands that she is not just an ordinary self oriented individual, she is a symbol of honour for her family, she is connected with the honor of her family members....And she understands that she is a precious being.

4-It prevents many unnecessory affairs and scandals.....

5-It prevents vulgarity, and nudity from the society....... which is necessory for a Man, more than any woman....Why it is necessory?....It maintains the attraction between men and women....You read the literature of our societies, the poets have written beatiful poems, just because he saw the fingers of his sweetheart behind the curtains of a window, all he saw a mere glance of Hina coloured hand, may be never saw her face and yet he wrote a masterpice poetry expressing a refined sense of beauty.......On the other hand in society where a man watches the nudity in streets all the times, it leaves no room for imaginative faculty,he looses that flame........Ultimately it does not stirr anything in his feelings, and eventually impotency creeps in. See for yourself the fertility rate of Muslims and others
My few cents.......

whatsup001 · #**192** 11-24-2009, 03:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Resonant

Well there is a genuine reason for Muslim women for Purdah, and that is, that their religion ask them to do....that's all.
Why Islam asked women for Pardah?.....Because:

1-In the cultured societies at that time and before, the Purdah was associated with Modesty...The highly respectful ladies used to do Hijab, while the concubines (kaneez and londis) were not following this practice. So it was a cultural thing. . .A cultural thing which was not peculiar to arab societies only....That is the reason that during Haj and Umrah when men and women are reminded there true status of 'Slaves of Allah', they are advised to be in a state which resembles the external state of slaves,...men cant cover there heads (Covering of head was also a sign of a respectful person in society), women cant cover there Faces.....etc.

2- It gives some relief and protection to woman....If she is ugly or beatiful, in both cases it is a protection for her.

3-It gives a higher status to the muslim woman, because she understands that she is not just an ordinary self oriented individual, she is a symbol of honour for her family, she is connected with the honor of her family members....And she understands that she is a precious being.

4-It prevents many unnecessory affairs and scandals.....

5-It prevents vulgarity, and nudity from the society....... which is necessory for a Man, more than any woman....Why it is necessory?....It maintains the attraction between men and women....You read the literature of our societies, the poets have written beatiful poems, just because he saw the fingers of his sweetheart behind the curtains of a window, all he saw a mere glance of Hina coloured hand, may be never saw her face and yet he wrote a masterpice poetry expressing a refined sense of beauty.......On the other hand in society where a man watches the nudity in streets all the times, it leaves no room for imaginative faculty,he looses that flame........Ultimately it does not stirr anything in his feelings, and eventually impotency creeps in. See for yourself the fertility rate of Muslims and others
My few cents.......

Good post

komal* · #**193** 11-24-2009, 03:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Resonant

Well there is a genuine reason for Muslim women for Purdah, and that is, that their religion ask them to do....that's all.
Why Islam asked women for Pardah?.....Because:

1-In the cultured societies at that time and before, the Purdah was associated with Modesty...The highly respectful ladies used to do Hijab, while the concubines (kaneez and londis) were not following this practice. So it was a cultural thing. . .A cultural thing which was not peculiar to arab societies only....That is the reason that during Haj and Umrah when men and women are reminded there true status of 'Slaves of Allah', they are advised to be in a state which resembles the external state of slaves,...men cant cover there heads (Covering of head was also a sign of a respectful person in society), women cant cover there Faces.....etc.

2- It gives some relief and protection to woman....If she is ugly or beatiful, in both cases it is a protection for her.

3-It gives a higher status to the muslim woman, because she understands that she is not just an ordinary self oriented individual, she is a symbol of honour for her family, she is connected with the honor of her family members....And she understands that she is a precious being.

4-It prevents many unnecessory affairs and scandals.....

5-It prevents vulgarity, and nudity from the society....... which is necessory for a Man, more than any woman....Why it is necessory?....It maintains the attraction between men and women....You read the literature of our societies, the poets have written beatiful poems, just because he saw the fingers of his sweetheart behind the curtains of a window, all he saw a mere glance of Hina coloured hand, may be never saw her face and yet he wrote a masterpice poetry expressing a refined sense of beauty.......On the other hand in society where a man watches the nudity in streets all the times, it leaves no room for imaginative faculty,he looses that flame........Ultimately it does not stirr anything in his feelings, and eventually impotency creeps in. See for yourself the fertility rate of Muslims and others
My few cents.......

Without a doubt, this is the best post of this thread.